Ian Lindsay & Associates: Ian Lindsay of Lindsay and Associates has played an active role in the local community since 1979. He has been with RE/MAX Vancouver Island's most advanced real estate business network since 1996. Marketing and selling residential, rural, strata, recreational, investment, and project development real estate, you'll find true real estate professionals at ianlindsay.ca.

Rockin' Rhonda: Here comes Peter. Here comes Dave. Oh, listen. Bringing stories, making waves. No missing, spinning tales in the hot podcast cave. So laughs and insights everywhere. What a treat.

Peter McCully: This is the Pulse Community Podcast. Welcome back. I'm Peter McCully, and here on mid-Vancouver Island, we're squeezing every last drop out of summer. The evenings are getting shorter, but the patios are still full, and there's plenty left on the calendar before we finally let the season go.

Dave Graham: And I'm Dave Graham.

I should warn you up front, I'm feeling a little iffy today, not quite sure of myself. I believe my house is turning against me, okay? More and more it belongs to the machines now. I think my coffee maker's been talking to the fridge 'cause it has apparently decided that I should be drinking less coffee.

Peter McCully: Is it possible, Dave, that you accidentally changed a setting on your coffee maker?

Dave Graham: I have no idea, Peter. I've just been noticing that stuff happens around me, and I no longer know how or why. For example, I was providing music for a street dance downtown Parksville the other night, and the computer I was using decided that it should darken its screen by itself without my knowledge or approval.

This happened several times. And no, it wasn't going to sleep. It was making its screen go dark. This morning, my toothbrush got all judgy when I apparently quit brushing too soon. I'm not sure if I should be concerned because technology's taking over, or maybe I just need to relax and let it be because this is just a normal part of the aging process.

I don't know. What do you think?

Peter McCully: Well, I think we have a show to do, so let's get at it.

Dave Graham: Is this even happening right now? Maybe we're just characters in a machine's dream. Okay, not a good time to follow that rabbit hole. Yes, we have a show, and it will feature Chris Frye. He's a founding member of The Bills, the Juno-nominated Canadian acoustic supergroup marking 30 years together.

The Bills will be bringing their genre-bending folk roots to Parksville's Knox United Church as part of the Salish Coast Music Festival.

Chris Frye: The Bills are a really positive force. We pride ourselves on making people smile. This world has plenty to be worried and concerned about and anxious about it, but it's just who we are as a group.

So for sure we wanna make people feel up when they leave the show, upbeat. We'd love them to have some of the tunes stuck in their head. We try to write songs that stick with you and are catchy and maybe have meaning for people.

Peter McCully: Semaglutide is an anti-diabetic medication used for the treatment of Type 2 diabetes, and it's an anti-obesity medication used for long-term weight management.

Recently, generic semaglutide has become available in Canada. Pharmacist Aki Shaw will explain.

Aki Shaw: Cholesterol, it's very hard to melt it down. It helps with, which is otherwise very hard to do so. Because the cholesterol levels go down and the weight drops, it again affects positively to diabetes and then also cardiovascular health and a lot of other things.

And then there are also a few more studies going on, how it might help with addiction, and that reducing craving for everything, not just food, but also for other things like nicotine or chocolate or whatever. Studies have found that it improves grey matter, but that's in very early stages

Dave Graham: Reducing cravings for chocolate.

I can hear the words, but you string them together like that and they just lose all meaning. Reduce cravings for chocolate. Ah, might as well be advanced calculus. There's just no understanding some things.

Peter McCully: On an upcoming podcast, Paul Black, a blues singer-songwriter from Victoria, will be playing in the Mid-Island area in September.

He's bringing some music and some good stories to go with it.

Dave Graham: Ah, Victoria to the Mid-Island in September. That makes for a nice little road trip, assuming your GPS isn't upset with you. Do you ever get attitude from your GPS? Mine thinks I'm a fool. I can hear it in her voice. Anyway, you won't need a map to take in the Route 19A Arts Festival.

Just follow the highway to art shows, open studios, live performances, and more. Sheena McCorkadale will be joining us soon to talk about it.

Peter McCully: And the SOS has a new program for seniors. Bonnie Brown will join us to tell us more about that as well.

Hi, is this Christina Zanchetta?

Christina Zanchetta: Yes, it is.

Peter McCully: Peter McCully calling from The Pulse Community Podcast.

Christina Zanchetta: Hi.

Peter McCully: Can you guess why I'm calling you today?

Christina Zanchetta: Did I win some tickets?

Peter McCully: As Dave Graham says, you've won the last two tickets in the universe to see Blue Rodeo in Parksville.

Christina Zanchetta: Awesome.

Peter McCully: So thanks very much for entering our contest.

I see that when you entered the contest, we had asked folks what their favourite Blue Rodeo song was, and you said Bad Timing.

Christina Zanchetta: Yes.

Peter McCully: I have to say, this is pretty good timing, Christina.

Christina Zanchetta: Yeah, that is.

Peter McCully: You will be the winner of a general admission pass for two, two folding camp chairs, and a $100 Thrifty Foods gift card for some munchies.

Christina Zanchetta: Sounds good. Thank you so much. Bye.

Thrifty Foods Parksville: At Thrifty Foods, we love to help nonprofits, charities, and schools. Our Thrifty Foods Smile Card bulk program allows organizations to immediately save up to 6% on the purchase of Smile Cards in bulk, allowing you to keep more money in your organization's pockets. Ask for details at Thrifty Foods in Parksville.

Dave Graham: We have a new contest you can check out on our website, thepulsecommunity.ca, or you'll see it on our social pages, Facebook and Instagram.

Peter McCully: It's a giveaway celebrating Roy Henry Vickers' 80th birthday. We have four books to give away, including The Best of Roy Henry Vickers, 80 Selected Works.

Dave Graham: Let's get to our first guest.

Here's Marilyn.

Marilyn: Semaglutide is an anti-diabetic medication used for the treatment of type 2 diabetes and an anti-obesity medication used for long-term weight management. Recently, generic semaglutide has become available. Here to talk more in depth about that is pharmacist Aki Shaw.

Peter McCully: Welcome back to the podcast, Aki.

Aki Shaw: Thank you for having me.

Peter McCully: Could you explain in simple terms how semaglutide works in the body to help with weight loss and diabetes management?

Aki Shaw: It was first created for diabetes management, and then they found out it acts on the GLP-1 receptor. So let's say a little more than half is involved in blood sugar management, and then a part of it is in weight loss management, like fat metabolism.

The blood sugar part gets taken care of very well, and because it's a hormone, you don't need it a lot. You just need a little bit, and also for like just once a week. Whereas the fat metabolism part, it does a few things, the GLP-1. First, as you lose weight, your body's metabolism dials down. Ozempic doesn't let it dial down.

It just keeps it the way it is. So that holds the metabolic rate the same as you are losing weight. And that again accelerates more because it adds up. Let's say you were X amount of pound and you needed more energy to move around, but you are now needing less energy to move around, but you're still having the same metabolic rate as before.

So that helps. Then there's also leptin and ghrelin. It improves the amount of leptin, which is like the hormone of satiety, and then reduces the amount of ghrelin, which is like the hormone for craving and appetite. So that helps. A few other things. One is like that it reduces the gastric transit time, which also adds to some of the side effects for sure, like constipation and acid reflux, because food is moving that much slower throughout the stomach And that's why I tell patients to be well-hydrated because the more the food stays, the harder the stools become, and then you get constipated.

Basically, because the food is moving down slowly, you get full quicker, so that combined with increased leptin levels, you're already feeling satiated. You don't feel like eating all the time. Also, the metabolic rate. So all of those combined and put together, that creates that weight loss effect.

Peter McCully: Now that semaglutide has been around for a while, beyond the weight loss, what other health benefits might patients experience when they're taking semaglutide?

Aki Shaw: In general, if most of the complaints, if it suits or not, are mostly related to the gastric transit time, they feel constipated and bloated, but a lot of patients get through it or they don't face that at all. For those patients that the medication is suited, it's also working on the interstitial fat, like the hardening and stiffening of the arteries, because that's also, in a way, fat, like it's cholesterol.

So those cholesterol, it's very hard to melt it down. It helps with, which is otherwise very hard to do so. It also overall improves like a lot of things like, say, because the cholesterol levels go down and the weight drops, it again affects positively to diabetes and then also cardiovascular health and a lot of other things.

And then there are also a few more studies going on how it might help with addiction, and that's mostly related to the leptin because it increases that leptin part. Reduce ghrelin is more so like reducing craving for everything, not just food, but also for other things like nicotine or chocolate or whatever.

That's how it helps. That's how they're being studied for addiction, if it can help with that. Also with memory because some studies have found that it improves grey matter, but that's in very early stages. It may or may not be the case, but that's how it could help in other domains as well.

Peter McCully: Interesting.

Now, for patients using semaglutide for weight management, what expectations should they have regarding long-term use? Is it typically viewed as a lifelong medication?

Aki Shaw: Drug companies would say that, and of course, their perspective is for diabetic management. But let's say if you're not diabetic or say your diabetes just reduced and it wasn't high to begin with, and with Ozempic, you crossed that barrier where you don't need as much of medication for diabetes or any of it, yeah, you can get off of it.

It's just a little hard. You have to stage it, and it would take like a good year. Basically, each time you dial down your dose, your metabolic rate would shift a little, your weight would increase a few pounds, and then you bring it back down again. And then you reduce the dose again. It will increase a little.

You bring it back down to the baseline. And if you do it that way, you would sustainably be able to get off of it. But if you just stop cold turkey, it's just like basic chemical reaction, your metabolic rate drops, and then you would gain where you were and some.

Peter McCully: Canada became one of the first countries to approve a generic semaglutide this year, and it's assumed that the generics would run much cheaper than the brand names.

Are you seeing savings like that for patients who are switching over?

Aki Shaw: Yeah, it's an interesting story. Actually, rest of the world, it expires twenty thirty-one. We are lucky because Novo Nordisk forgot to file their patent filing fees. Health Canada gave them two years to pay, but they didn't, and then the judge sided on Health Canada's side, like, "Those guys have way more money than two hundred or four hundred dollars to pay it off," and given enough time.

So that's how we got lucky with the semaglutide getting generic faster than rest of the world. It's a good thing for patients because, yes, it's a huge savings. Right now we just have two approved and one actually available, and it's at ninety dollars instead of two fifty to two eighty, depending on where you purchased.

Once we have four or more, which is going to be, then it will be, like, around sixty, so, like, twenty-five percent of the cost of the brand. So yes, it's gonna be huge savings.

Peter McCully: Now, what should a patient know about switching from Ozempic to a generic? Is it pretty straightforward, or are there things to watch for?

Aki Shaw: It's a straight switch. In eyes of Health Canada, it's the same, be it Ozempic or the generic. Same medication, same dosage, same delivery, so exactly same switch. Nothing special.

Peter McCully: And the insurers treat it the same way, the provincial or the private insurers?

Aki Shaw: They will, and most of them, they would stop covering the brand, so then you would have no choice but to do the generic.

Yeah, for sure. The whole system saves money with generics, right? If you're paying out of pocket, it's your money that you're saving. If it's the insurers that are paying for it, of course, that affects the premiums and stuff as well for you if you have less spending with them. So overall, yes, everyone, be it personally or insurance, would be excited for the generic part.

Peter McCully: Now, these are all needles. Is there an oral semaglutide in the works?

Aki Shaw: There is already an oral Rybelsus. So Rybelsus, Wegovy, they're all still running like the brand, and they cost way higher than the Ozempic, which is the one that lost its patent. So yeah, Rybelsus again will cost like around two fifty to three hundred, depending on where you get it from.

So which is the same price as the Ozempic. The only difference is it's a daily pill, and as per studies, there is more gastric side effects with the oral compared to the injected.

Peter McCully: So I wonder now that we've just had the generic arrive, is it early enough to judge whether patient demand has shifted since the generic news?

Are more people starting to ask about semaglutide now that it's more affordable?

Aki Shaw: Asking, yes. The demand, is still the same, but asking for sure, and that eventually in few months might convert into more demand because people who are holding off because of price or something, for sure they would start looking into it, and some of them might go ahead with the decision of trying it.

So yeah, for sure it will make a difference in the demand for semaglutide.

Peter McCully: What misconceptions about semaglutides do you commonly encounter, and what facts would you like the public to better understand?

Aki Shaw: Semaglutide was the second one. First was the liraglutide, which was the Trulicity and stuff. They didn't have much weight loss effect, just three to 6%, barely 8%.

Then this one had 9 to 12%. And then the newer ones in the category, which is tirzepatide and retatrutide, they act on more receptors than just GLP-1. They act on GIP. The even newer ones than Mounjaro, they act on the glucagon receptors. So they for sure have a lot more weight loss. But when you just search GLP-1 inhibitors weight loss, mostly in the Internet you'll see the one that is the best version of it, which is 18 to 21%, but that hasn't even released yet.

Ozempic is 9 to 12%. Sometimes it could happen that there are outliers, and they get noticed quite quickly that someone was X amount of pounds and now they're half the size, and patients expect that's gonna happen to them as well. But ideally, you would say 10 to 12%. And that's good in a way because that's without the hard work, right?

Because that was the control study where they're not doing anything else but just the Ozempic. So if you add extra to it, say diet and exercise, for sure it could go way more than 12%. So the diet and exercise part is very important, and especially if you dream of coming off of it and not staying on it for life.

Peter McCully: So when you say 12%, is that referring to body weight?

Aki Shaw: Body weight, yes, and fat. Body loses protein first and then fat after. That's how our early days mind is evolved to it. Fat is still precious, and protein was a regularly available source when we did hunting and gathering. But nowadays it's the opposite.

We get carbs and fat very easily compared to protein. So it's very important for patients who are starting it to have some weight-bearing exercise. It may not improve musculature everywhere. Let's say if you do dumbbells with hands, it won't improve muscles on your legs, but it will release enough growth hormone to keep the musculature everywhere intact.

If you don't do that, expect to lose muscle first and then fat, which is very bad because then you get more chances of being frail, especially if you're old.

Peter McCully: As a pharmacist, Aki, what has surprised you most about the whole semaglutide phenomenon and its impact on healthcare?

Aki Shaw: Its impact on healthcare is being noticed and will be more noticeable because what's happening right now is, say someone's on Ozempic, their metformin dosage is cut in half.

Some of them have had to totally stop it. All the other medications, they had to reduce their dose, which won't get noticed right away because those are cheaper generic medications. But over time, like, when the same class of medication, especially the newer ones, when they also start to go generic, you'll see a lot of difference in cardiac arrests because, as I said, like, it also reduces the stubborn fat.

Yes, I think the appeal is the weight loss, then all the other positive effects it has, which, of course, not many people are looking forward to it and not know about it, but it will for sure impact the healthcare system.

Peter McCully: We're talking about the generic semaglutide, and some have been approved, and are only ones on the market.

Do you think there'll be more coming to market in the very near future?

Aki Shaw: At least six months. Six months for the one that's already approved, and there are eight in line. It's just like when you're getting your home renovated. Like, it takes, like, years to get the building permit. It's very similar with Health Canada.

Like, it takes time for them to process all this. From getting to 90 to 60, I would say it will be end of next year. So till then, 90 is the deal, and then hopefully, as soon as Health Canada is done with rest of the applications, end of 2027 or start of '28, it will be around 60.

Dave Graham: Pharmacist Aki Shaw. There's a lot more going on with semaglutide than most of us realized, from cholesterol to cravings to some very early research on brain health.

Peter McCully: It's

Dave Graham: Good information to have, especially with the generic version

Peter McCully: Now on the market in Canada.

Dave Graham: Yeah. Sorry, I was trying to stifle a yawn. My phone decided I needed an alarm extra early this morning. Now, I don't recall setting it. I might have without knowing it. I don't know anymore. Here's a thought, though.

What if my phone's been talking to my coffee maker?

Peter McCully: Huh?

Dave Graham: I bet that's it. They're in cahoots.

Peter McCully: Yeah, that's it, Dave. Your appliances are in cahoots. Maybe all you need is a good nap. We've added Vancouver Island webcam links and podcast links to our website, thepulsecommunity.ca, so now you can find other Vancouver Island podcasts as well as all the other good information that we have to share.

Dave Graham: You can also find us on Apple, Amazon, iHeart, Spotify, TikTok, and YouTube. Plus, we're on Facebook and Instagram.

Fireside Books: There's exciting news for book lovers. Fireside Books in Parksville now has a second location in Port Alberni. The Book Worm. Used books are just five dollars or less. The Book Worm on the corner of Redford and Anderson opens seven days a week from ten to five.

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Details available online. Ask about returning books for a book credit. Fireside Books and The Book Worm, two locations, one amazing adventure in browsing.

Ian Lindsay & Associates: Ian Lindsay of Lindsay & Associates has played an active role in the local community since 1979. He has been with RE/MAX, Vancouver Island's most advanced real estate business network, since 1996, marketing and selling residential, rural, strata, recreational, investment, and project development real estate.

You'll find true real estate professionals at ianlindsay.ca.

Peter McCully: If you have someone in mind that you think we should be talking to, then please speak to us. You can reach us and leave us a voice or text message. Head to our website. Click on the contact link. You'll find us at thepulsecommunity.ca.

Dave Graham: At least our website behaves as it should.

It doesn't have opinions. My smart speaker cut me off twice this morning to fact-check a story I was telling about my own weekend. Apparently, I may be misremembering. Well, actually, if you think about it, that's entirely possible.

Peter McCully: Well, it's hard to argue with a machine that's confident. Let's get to our next guest.

Here's Marilyn.

Marilyn: Chris Frye is a founding member of The Bills, the Juno-nominated Canadian acoustic supergroup marking 30 years together this year. The Bills will be bringing their genre-bending folk roots to Parksville's Knox United Church as part of the Salish Coast Music Festival.

Peter McCully: Chris, welcome to the podcast.

Thanks for joining us.

Chris Frye: Hi, Peter. Thanks very much for having me. Really happy to be here.

Peter McCully: You remember The Bills, which started pretty much 30 years ago as The Hillbilly Band, and anybody that's been in a band will tell you that 30 years is a rare, a rare milestone. What do you think has kept the five of you together and creative for this long?

Chris Frye: Ooh, that's a good opening question. First, a minor correction, but one of the reasons we changed that original kinda goofy name of the band is it was hard to get right, and unfortunately, you're one of the many who just mixed up the letters in that name. Our super funny gag was we were The Bill Hilley Band, not The Hillbilly Band, which is what you just said, if I caught it correctly.

So The Bill Hilley Band, like it was someone's name, and we had a whole backstory, and we took on not deep, the theatrical characters, but we all had names. We were all Bill, and I was Bill Guitar. And MC after MC at show after festival would call us The Hillbilly Band or The Hillbillies or The Bill Hillies, and we were The Bill Hilley Band.

We thought, "We can't go on like this," so after about six, seven years, we changed the name. So we became The Bills, which is what we just referred to ourself as. Years later, of course, people were looking for us, and they'd find this NFL team from Buffalo, and that hasn't always been the smartest career move.

But I think your question of what's kept us creative - a couple of really nice things about the band's origins were totally about exploring music together. It was never like, "Let's put a band together and go on tour," or go do those kind of things, make records. It was like a bunch of people who were musicians at different stages in their careers here in Victoria wanted to get together and play folk music.

That was the main underlying thing, was let's play acoustic instruments. We're not gonna have any drum kits or anything like that. Let's explore music from all over the world. So the foundation of the band was very exploratory, very open, very like, "Hey, oh, you got a song in Spanish? Great. You've got a Ukrainian saying that your grandmother used to sing.

Let's do it. Let's do, let's do some bluegrass music. Let's do whatever." So the openness, we really owe that to Scott White, who was in the band, then went away for a number of years to work in Germany with a Cirque du Soleil show and other shows, play music, came back. He's back as the bassist, and Mark Atkinson, who's the mandolin player and has done a bunch of guitar playing, too.

So Mark and Scott, they brought this creative, open, exploratory idea to the band. We've kept the core together pretty much. Adrian joined about four years later, and Richard joined about four years after that. Richard's been in the band 22, 23 years, and he's the youngest member of the group. So everybody who comes into the group understands it's all about that foundation of being exploratory, anything goes.

Let's come up with cool arrangements. Let's not do anything by the book. And if anybody labels us eclectic, which they always have, so be it. That's who we are. We run through all these different ideas, and we try to do it very, very well, what we do. We set a very high bar for our execution and our ideas and our lyrics, 'cause we do a ton of original music.

But that's going back to the very beginning to answer your question, how have we maintained it well. It was kinda the way the band was founded, was to be creative. We wouldn't be this band, we would've disbanded years ago if we'd sorta felt we'd lost that spark.

Peter McCully: I always hesitate to try and put someone in a genre, but if you had to describe what makes The Bills sound instantly recognizable to someone who hasn't heard your band before, what would you point to?

Chris Frye: It is interesting because one could jump through a few songs. Like, if you pick the most different songs on one of our records, you'd be like, "What is this? This is not the same band." What would make it recognizable in terms of compared to other groups that one might hear? Certainly, the level of care and thought that goes into the arrangements is very unique in The Bills.

We like to really allow room for improvisation. We have some incredible instrumentalists in this band, Richard Moody on the violin, Mark Atkinson on the mandolin, Adrian Dolan on violin and accordion. Like, these guys, we have to give them space to do what they do. So one of our few maybe very recognizable traits is the songs are arranged in such a way that you're gonna hear some fantastic soloing or group arrangements that are very unique and exciting, at least we hope they are for everybody, and we've heard that they are.

So it's not sort of paint by numbers folk music at all. We do like to refer to it as kind of folk roots music for sure. You also hear, very strong acoustic focus. That makes us very recognizable for sure. Our lyrics, if someone's listening to the words, they're gonna hear a lot of references to Vancouver Island and to where we're from, and that makes us, I think, quite unique.

That is, of course, folk music historically. That's what it is. It's all about kind of singing about where you're from and the stories and tales of your place. So we've really taken that on. That's the torch that certainly I carry, and I think the band does, too. You're not gonna hear very many songs where people are singing about an older fisherman from Bamfield.

I mean, maybe it's happened before, but that's, certainly the kind of direction we go. And then maybe lastly, I would just say that our attention to vocal harmonies, we're not the best in the world, and we're not totally unique in that, but we do really pride ourselves on having three, four-part vocal harmonies in a lot of the stuff that we do.

And I think when you put all of those things together, a focus on the subject matter being local to Vancouver Island, be it British Columbia, the vocal harmonies, the incredible instrumental flights of fancy, the improvisation, these things, I think all make The Bills unique. That's a very long-winded answer.

Peter McCully: What's the writing and arranging process like with five multi-instrumentalists? Does everybody bring in their finished ideas, or does it just happen when you all get in a room together?

Chris Frye: It's been different for different songs. Just, probably like most groups that anybody would have followed if they have multiple writers, composers.

One of the very common team on many of the records has been Mark Atkinson and I. We will get together and I'll have an idea that's a good foundation for a song, but he'll have ideas for arrangement and instrumental melodic pieces, and we put them together. But other times it's been like that as well.

I'll have a chorus that I'm singing and something I'm doing, and Richard Moody will have a great little fiddle lick that he's come up with, and we find a way to fuse those. Adrian's been the same thing. Also, a few of us have written songs totally on our own and brought them to the band, and they've basically come through with a few little added touches, but, really the original composer, the original writer did most of the song.

So it's a real mixed bag. The most exciting is when there's some group collaboration. I mean, that's really fun when it works out. Those are the moments, and we've had a lot of them, so I'd say we err on the side of collaboration.

Peter McCully: How do you decide what stays a Bills thing versus what goes into your own projects?

Because as you mentioned, you each have significant solo and side careers.

Chris Frye: That's one way you'd stick together for 30 years, is you take some time off and do other things, on your own. So we're all excited when we come back together as The Bills rather than sick of each other. I think that with all of our solo projects, like Mark has a wonderful trio that he's led for a long, long time as well, going on probably 27 years, 28 years, the Mark Atkinson Trio, and it's all instrumental music, so there's no singing in that stuff.

So that's certainly one thing. When he's got an idea that's a guitar-driven instrumental piece, that goes to the Mark Atkinson Trio most of the time. We have done a little bit of that with The Bills. But for me, I have released three albums as a singer-songwriter, and I utilize various other musicians, including some from The Bills on my records.

Probably the difference is I don't focus wholly on folk roots music. My stuff can lean a little bit more towards, if you wanna call it American or Canadiana pop kinda stuff. There definitely could be horn sections and drums and stuff. So a lot of it has to do with, like, the flavour of the music will make it sort of go one direction or another.

I will say that Mark Atkinson, way back in his early days, recorded some demos that were kinda rock-ish, and then years later, we took those songs and Bill-ified them. So we have picked up some old material that was written for one context and delivered it Bills style.

Peter McCully: And that's what music's all about.

It's always fascinating to look and see what's out there right at the moment, and then take a look at where it's been before. Old songs discovering a whole new audience in a different genre.

Chris Frye: Absolutely. We sort of pride ourselves on that Bill-ification. We used to do more covers, for sure. Our first couple records we were doing cover songs, and again, we like to put our own stamp on them, for sure.

But writing is much more gratifying. Playing a song that you've composed and it seems to move an audience is a wonderful feeling.

Peter McCully: One of your albums, The Trail of Tales, was a record where all five of your members were contributing songwriting.

Chris Frye: Yeah, it was a first for us. I will say it's been too long since we released an album.

That was our most recent record. It's over a, it's a decade ago or something like that. We're definitely due for some new material, hoping to do that to celebrate our 30th anniversary here. We're basically calling it a year-long anniversary. That album we recorded very differently than the other records, so it is another great question, Peter.

We rented a big house on Mayne Island that there's been recording in this house before. We set up for three weeks together and ate together, wrote together, and recorded together, and it was a really different experience. But in the past we've come into the studio, gone home every night, back and forth, and this was a totally immersive experience, and I think it did allow for more openings and things kind of would crawl out during dessert, or two people out for a morning run, and all these different contexts we were spending time together, and it worked out really beautifully.

And it's quite interesting how those songs, like all five of us as composers are featured in our shows now. We're gonna do music that each person's been involved in writing. That was a great moment, and I wish we'd followed up, the next year with another record, but life was busy and people were doing other projects.

And Scott, who was in Germany, as I mentioned, going back and forth for a long time, so it was kinda hard to nail him down to do a recording project. He'd come back, we'd do a few shows. So now the band's all here. We're turning 30. Yeah, I think it's time for some new music, for sure.

Peter McCully: So Chris, how has the band's sound evolved over these 30 years?

Chris Frye: In some ways, I think there has been evolution. In other ways, some things have remained unchanged, and in some cases we have chosen to simplify certain aspects in certain songs. I think the evolution is along the way we work together, for sure, and our drive to write songs that are mature in that we're not rushing, we're not trying to fit too many things in.

I think when we were younger, well, although we weren't like super young, Adrian was young when he joined the band. He was only 17 when he joined the band, but the rest of us were kind of around 30 when the whole thing got really going. I think that we are okay with songs that boil down to the emotion and the simplicity at times, now more so than we were.

And, earlier on, we really worked writing, at least in some cases, sort of anthems. A really good example of that is this song Let 'Em Run that was the title track of an album we released 22 years ago in 2004, and it was a great success for us. It got a Juno nomination in the sort of folk roots category for Album of the Year.

I had this lyric, I woke up, we were touring Canada, we were in Saskatoon of all places, and for whatever reason, you wake up in the morning in some weird hotel room and this idea of, let 'em run as in free run kind of chickens, but then it being a whole metaphor for this, that, and the other. And so I wrote down all these words, came up with the basic concept, but then started talking to Mark about it, and he had this really cool crosspicking style lick on the mandolin, which is quite difficult to play, but he's a real ace, with his picking skills.

So he was like, "Check this out." And then together we decided Let 'Em Run's kind of catchy as a chorus. We just came up with this long, we just sing, let 'em run, and you hold run for a long, long time. We could just picture ourselves, in front of 50,000 people waving their lighters and singing Let 'Em Run.

So it was a great example of collaborative songwriting, and it was right at that period where we were really going, we were writing songs that had that great big feel that have stuck in the set. I think it was a good example of kind of the midpoint of our evolution.

Song: 'Let 'Em Run' - The Bills

Peter McCully: Bills, let them run Chris, the Salish Coast Music Festival bills you as part of its celebration of Vancouver Island music. What draws the Bills to a festival like this?

Chris Frye: The thing is, I don't know if we've ever played right in Parksville, if you can believe it. I'm actually shaking my head trying to figure out if we have.

So for sure, getting to play in a new place is always exciting. Second thing is we've heard wonderful things about the Knox Church as a performance venue, so very excited to perform there. The acoustics sound like they're wonderful, and I'll tell you, we've played in some beautiful rooms, and we've played in some crummy rooms for an acoustic band, and this sounds like just the right spot.

We know that the community up there is great. Being associated with any event or festival that prides itself on featuring music from the region, we love to be a part of that. It's an afternoon show, and that's also kind of an interesting draw. We like matinees. There's a different vibe when you play in the daytime.

It's a holiday Monday. That's kind of a wonderful time to play music. You know? It's not at night. It's not dark. People aren't thinking about how they're gonna get home after the show. Sometimes it's even a different kind of audience. So all those things, all the above, have us excited about coming and playing the festival.

Peter McCully: Now, what do you hope an audience takes away from a Bills show, those who have followed you since the early 2000s versus those who are going to be hearing you for the very first time?

Chris Frye: Those who've followed us since the late '90s, if you can believe it, a previous century, there are a few things that people seem to take away and that we really pride ourselves in.

One is positivity. Like, not that we don't have some songs that explore some tougher, kind of subjects, but The Bills are a really positive force. We pride ourselves on making people smile. This world has plenty to be worried and concerned about and anxious about, and, but it's just who we are as a group.

So for sure, we wanna make people feel up when they leave the show, upbeat. We'd love them to have some of the tunes stuck in their head. We try to write songs that stick with you and are catchy and maybe have meaning for people, and that maybe people even go away and sing themselves.

Really always excited to hear that someone has worked out one of our tunes or is playing it with their group or singing it with their band in whatever context they get together and make music in. And I guess, an invitation back to the following year's festival.

Peter McCully: And maybe that's the answer to your new album you've been searching for time to record, is to record a live album.

Chris Frye: It's certainly been discussed. It's a great idea. You know what? It's good to refresh that thought in our minds, Peter. Thanks. We should definitely do that. I think we're overdue.

Peter McCully: Now, 30 years on, what does the Bills' legacy mean to you personally, and where would you like to see the band in, say, another 10 years?

Chris Frye: I think we all are really proud of the band, and in all the other things that we do, people, we like to say that we're a part of the band. Now, we were never, like, huge, but we did play a lot and toured a lot and were out there. And the legacy of the band is that I hope that people who have heard us, and I know that people who've heard us, have been inspired to play themselves and bring their kids.

Lots of kids grew up on the albums like Let 'Em Run. That record, you would be amazed how many people come up to me, who look sort of like 30-somethings or 20-somethings or whatever they are, and they're like, "When I was a child, our road trips always had that song playing. We'd all sing along."

So those things are all great. And 10 years from now - I sort of am the manager of the band. I'm the one who shepherds the guys together and stuff. I would like to push this group to record some new music, not just one album. Make a live album, make a new studio album. Maybe even two or three records in the next 10 years.

Now, that's super ambitious coming out of my... But now that I've said it on tape, that would be something I'd love to see us do, because it's just too good a band, I feel, to not be making new music and recording. So that's what I'd love to get done in the next decade.

Dave Graham: What a band. When I think of The Bills, I think of how renowned they are for their instrumental virtuosity, lush vocal arrangements, evocative songwriting, and a refreshing sound that transcends musical boundaries and defies simple categorization.

Okay, not my words. It came off their website, but it speaks well of them. More details on the Salish Coast Music Festival can be found on their website, and we'll have the link in our show notes.

Peter McCully: 30 years on, and The Bills are still bringing people together. Well, that's the kind of milestone that's worth celebrating, Dave.

Dave Graham: Here at The Pulse Community, we keep the young ones entertained with our Skookum Kids stories featuring Captain Dave and the crew of the Mellow Submarine, and Peter and Gracie, the Eskimo dog. And our kids stories now offer colouring pages to go along with each new episode.

Peter McCully: In this week's episode of the Mellow Submarine, Captain Dave and Larry the Lobster visit their old friend Marina the Mermaid.

Dave Graham: And our Radio Archaeology classic radio series features original episodes of Dragnet, featuring Sergeant Joe Friday, and Gunsmoke, with Marshal Matt Dillon.

Peter McCully: As part of our Pulse Community podcast, join Cindy Thompson of Parksville for a resilience project. The world's leading resilience expert, Dr. Terri Stayiskill, joined Cindy Thompson to share her five practices framework, and her own story of dyslexia and PTSD.

Dave Graham: This week's edition of Non-Partisan Hacks, hosted by Joel Grenz and Sean Wood, is also now available. John Jack, the chief councillor for the Huu-ay-aht First Nations and chairperson of the Alberni-Clayoquot Regional District will be on the program.

Peter McCully: You'll find these podcasts and more at thepulsecommunity.ca.

Dave Graham: And while you're on the website, sign up for our weekly newsletter. It'll keep you up to date on the latest podcasts, guests, and contests.

Peter McCully: Good luck to everyone entered in our Roy Henry Vickers giveaway, and congratulations again to Christina Zanchetta, our Blue Rodeo ticket winner.

Dave Graham: Yes. Enjoy the show. As for me, I'm going home to a coffee maker, a toothbrush, an alarm clock, and a smart speaker that all need some attitude adjustments.

Peter McCully: Do they, Dave? Do they?

Dave Graham: Or maybe I'll pull their plugs and just go old school. Oh, no, I shouldn't have said anything. Now they'll be waiting for me.

Rockin' Rhonda & The Uptown Blues Band: Here comes Peter, here comes Dave, oh listen. Bringing stories, making waves, no missing. Spinning tales in the podcast cave, so to speak. Laughs and insights everywhere - what a treat. Peter and Dave, they're on the mics. All right, join the ride. It's gonna feel just right.