Ian Lindsay & Associates: Ian Lindsay of Lindsay and Associates has played an active role in the local community since 1979. He has been with RE/MAX, Vancouver Island's most advanced real estate business network, since 1996, marketing and selling residential, rural, strata, recreational, investment, and project development real estate. You'll find true real estate professionals at ianlindsay.ca.

Rockin' Rhonda: Here comes Peter. Here comes Dave. Oh, listen. Bringing stories, making waves. No missing, spinning tales in the hot podcast cave. So laughs and insights everywhere. What a treat.

Dave Graham: Welcome back to the PULSE Community Podcast. I'm Dave Graham, coming to you from the middle of Vancouver Island, roughly speaking, and we are getting set for another fabulous summer here in paradise.

Peter McCully: And I'm Peter McCully. Yes, with the change of the season, campgrounds and calendars are filling, and there's enough live music to keep you busy every weekend from now until the leaves turn.

Dave Graham: Oh, that's another thing I need to add to my list of things I want to do before September - see more live music. Oh boy, this summer list is getting full. I might have to drop something to keep it realistic. Okay, I'm going to scratch off watching every documentary by Ken Burns. That should be on the winter list anyway.

Dave Graham: That's number 27 on my list, right after learning to make sourdough from scratch. It's possible I may have too many things here.

Peter McCully: Well, it's good that you're not getting carried away with it. I had one item on my list: complete a 10K run. Yeah, that's not going to happen. I'm admitting defeat before I begin on that one. Instead, I've changed it to walk more briskly. I need to keep my goals within reasonable limits, I think.

Peter McCully: You'll want to make room for this one on your list, Dave - taking in the action in Port Alberni as HGTV's Hometown Makeover is there. Sarah and Brian Bauemler will be on the ground for the next couple of months making it happen.

Dave Graham: That is such wonderful news. Port Alberni has many things going for it, and I just can't wait to see how the Bauemlers can make it even better. I've been watching Brian charm his way through construction and repair projects for a long time now, and he inspires me to improve my handyman skills. Although I have to admit I still don't know the difference between a left and a right-handed hammer.

Peter McCully: Well, on today's podcast, Dave, we're joined by two guests who are each doing something remarkable in their own corners of Vancouver Island life. First, Laura Palmer of Port Alberni has just released Season 9 of the award-winning podcast Island Crime. Laura's a former CBC producer, and her true crime storytelling is some of the most meticulous victim-focused work in the genre.

Laura Palmer: The series is about the unsolved murders of Elizabeth and Andrew Kosonic. They were stabbed to death in their own home just south of Nanaimo in a community called South Wellington in June of 1959. I had never heard anything about the case until last year when I was approached by their great-great-granddaughter, who on her own has been researching the case and trying to understand this horrible tragedy in her family. She's a listener of my podcast and thought it might be something that I could work on together with her. So that's what we've been doing for the last six or seven months.

Dave Graham: An unsolved murder from 1959 and a determined great-granddaughter. Wow. Laura Palmer is a leader in an extraordinarily competitive field, and we are proud she is an Islander.

Peter McCully: Also with us today, Cheryl Dill, president of the Parksville Beach Festival Society. Cheryl oversees one of the largest summer events on Vancouver Island, drawing over 100,000 visitors to the Parksville Community Park each year. And this year's festival is shaping up to be something special.

Cheryl Dill: We had 119,092 people through the gate - almost 120,000. That is one of the highest amounts of visitors we'd had through that gate since 2015. In 2015, we had a banner year, just over 130,000. It had been trickling downward, and then with the pandemic it was really challenging to bring it back up. But last year was a really strong year.

Dave Graham: Almost 120,000 people in Parksville for BeachFest. This is a destination event. There's a real sense of civic pride when I think about the international recognition and all the people. Well, I feel also a bit of anxiety about finding a parking spot, but mostly I feel civic pride, and I am proud to be associated with it as the official DJ of BeachFest. I think I can call myself that. Have I mentioned that I'll be there?

Peter McCully: Well, it has been a couple of minutes, Dave. We're also excited to tell you about a brand-new podcast that has joined the PULSE Community. We invite you to check out Too Old or Movie Gold, in which host Olin Vanderleen of the Comox Valley gathers a panel together to weigh in on classic films. Gen X nostalgia meets fresh perspective from Millennials and Gen Z. It promises to be a lively debate.

Dave Graham: The first episode is about Backdraft, the firefighting action feature directed by Ron Howard. Joining the panel are Nanoose Bay Fire Department members Caitlin and Trevor Holm. They come from a three-generation firefighting family, just like the brothers in the film.

Peter McCully: Coming up on future episodes here on the PULSE Community Podcast, Doug Picard joins us to talk about the value of exercise in battling Parkinson's disease. It is a genuinely hopeful conversation, and we're looking forward to sharing it.

Dave Graham: And we have Jamie Wollam of Salt Spring Island. He's the drummer for Tears for Fears, one of the most iconic bands of the 1980s. I have to say, I only just learned of this. This is pretty cool. I don't know how you scored that one, Peter, but well played.

Peter McCully: And Carly Carey will be here to tell us about Carly's House in Nanaimo - a free, welcoming place for people to stay while undergoing cancer treatments. There's some remarkable work being done there, and it is a story worth hearing.

Peter McCully: Hi, is this Rhonda Carlson?

Rhonda Carlson: Yes, it is.

Peter McCully: Hey, Rhonda. It's Peter McCully calling from the PULSE Community Podcast. How are you today?

Rhonda Carlson: I'm good, thank you.

Peter McCully: Have you seen April Wine in concert before?

Rhonda Carlson: No, I haven't.

Peter McCully: Well, this'll be a good time to see them. Dave Graham just pulled your name from the draw drum, so we've got a couple of April Wine tickets for you for the opening of BeachFest. And so that you don't have to stand through the whole show, two folding camp chairs. And we've also got a $100 gift card courtesy of Thrifty Foods so you can get some snacks for the concert.

Rhonda Carlson: Oh, that's just awesome. Thank you so much.

Peter McCully: Oh, you're quite welcome. And I think the first time I saw them was 1972.

Rhonda Carlson: Oh, my goodness. Where was that?

Peter McCully: It would've been the Canada Day celebration weekend in Amherst, Nova Scotia.

Rhonda Carlson: Oh, really? Wow, isn't that something?

Peter McCully: Yeah. I wasn't old enough to drive, but-

Rhonda Carlson: I'm not going to tell you how old I was. But I'm looking forward to seeing them. That'll be so great.

 Beachfest: Summer on Vancouver Island doesn't get any better than this. Parksville Beach Festival is back, and this year the theme is Beauties and Beasts. 30 international master sculptors will transform tons of sand into breathtaking works of art right on Parksville Beach. Grand opening is July 10th with a ribbon-cutting ceremony at 2:00 PM, and opening weekend delivers something truly special. On July 11th, iconic Canadian rock legends April Wine headline the VanRock Interiors opening weekend concert. 16 albums, 11 Juno nominations, and a legacy that puts them in the company of the all-time greats. Tickets are on sale now. This is your summer. Don't let it pass you by. Parksville Beach Festival, where summer magic begins. Visit parksvillebeachfest.ca.

Peter McCully: Stay tuned to the podcast and our website and social pages for our upcoming summer giveaways. Watch for contests for BeachFest Rocks and Blue Rodeo.

Dave Graham: Blue Rodeo in Parksville. Oh, just letting that sink in. I'd put that on my summer to-do list, but I didn't get tickets and I'm not allowed to enter apparently. But you out there in podcast land - you are. Aside from that, we have an impressive list of concert options: SunFest, BeachFest, April Wine, the Nanaimo Blues Festival, Rock the Range, Music at the Museum. So many great shows. I'm going to have to put off learning how to scuba dive.

Peter McCully: Details and all the contests at thepulsecommunity.ca. And it's time to hear about BeachFest. Here's Marilyn to introduce our first guest.

Marilyn: Cheryl Dill is president of the Parksville Beach Festival Society, overseeing the summer festival that attracts over 100,000 visitors annually. Held in the Parksville Community Park, the world-renowned Quality Foods Sand Sculpting competition also offers five weeks of live entertainment.

Dave Graham: Cheryl, so nice to see you again, and welcome back to the podcast. I'm so excited to be talking to you about BeachFest for this coming year.

Cheryl Dill: Thank you, Dave. I love the podcast. I love listening to it. I think the work that you folks do is fantastic.

Dave Graham: Unsolicited, that was. Now, how was last year - the 2025 festival - in terms of overall attendance, and how does it compare to years before?

Cheryl Dill: We had incredible numbers last year. It was a first for us because we moved the site for the sand sculpting exhibition. We were at the round site closer to the gazebo and very close to the Gathering Place, and we've worked with the city to shift our site. So we had 119,092 people through the gate - almost 120,000. That is one of the highest amounts of visitors we'd had through that gate since 2015. In 2015, we had a banner year, just over 130,000. I'm not sure why that number was so strong in that year. We were gobsmacked, but it had been trickling downward, and then with the pandemic it was really challenging to bring it back up. But last year was a really strong year. We're really excited about that, and we think it's on an upward trend again.

Dave Graham: Did the new location have an impact on that, in terms of how you managed the whole event and crowds?

Cheryl Dill: We'd like to think that it did. These days, getting the word out there - social media, word of mouth - is always huge for us because so many residents bring their families and friends. Come out and visit, and we'll do the tour around Parksville and the area, and the sand sculpting exhibition is one of the main goals that families have when they bring visitors, because it's such an inspiring festival. The new location - we did a lot of marketing around that. We had an additional sculptor in there. It was our first year trying to figure out if this site was actually bigger than the round one. We had to do some math on that. It's slightly larger, but not necessarily in a sand sculpting way - it just gives the sculptors more space to have their lunches and an area for music. We also have an area where this year, for the first time, we're going to do a Sands and Sounds arts and crafts festival for families right inside there. We're really excited about that, as it gives us a little more room to be creative with the site. One of the reasons we ended up moving there in collaboration with the city is because where we were before, it was blocking the vista view of the ocean and where the Gathering Place was, plus there was a lot of pedestrian activity crossing traffic. Now where we are, it's right beside the large gravel parking lot and behind the curling rink, with paved parking nearby. It's much easier for people to get out of their vehicles, walk along the path, not cross moving traffic, and come right to our site.

Dave Graham: Last year, the PULSE Community Podcast was on hand for a while. It was Peter and yours truly, and we talked with many folks who would put up with us for a moment - from the island, of course, and Mexico, the Netherlands, and all over. That's evidenced each year by that wonderful map with the pins showing where everybody came from. When you take in that kind of expanse, does it ever make you just shake your head and wonder?

Cheryl Dill: It does, and just listening to you talk about that gives me goosebumps right now. When you think about here's little old Parksville, we're doing our thing, and we're all modest as a community, and yeah, we're proud of where we are, but the whole world knows where we are. When you look at that diversity of visitors and where they come from - by evidence of the pins on the map - it's incredible. You remember Joan Lemoine? She used to have a guest book and encourage people to tell her where they're from. The majority of people who come to our event are from Canada, but we have a huge portion - about 20% - from elsewhere in the world. From Greenland. From Japan. From Australia, New Zealand, Madagascar - you name it. They're identifying that they're coming from all over, and it really is wonderful to see that diversity come into our community. It helps our community grow and appreciate what we have.

Dave Graham: There is a theme for the sand sculpting portion of the festival each year. I'm wondering how that is chosen.

Cheryl Dill: Having a theme is a lot of fun because we get to be a bit more creative. When we decide on a theme, we ask our board directors, volunteers, and event managers to narrow down some ideas. We have a running list from many years that we revisit and add to. Then we ask our sculptors. We narrow it down to a few possibilities and ask their favorites, and many years we put it out to the public for a vote. The public and the sculptors chose Beauties and Beasts for this year. It's a well-known, family-friendly theme. It's not really about that Disney story - it's about all things beautiful and all things beastly, and there's a lot of that in the world. There's a lot of creativity there. It could be everything from an inclusion concept to scary and wonderful things about our lives. What will be interesting is how the sculptors interpret it. We always want to choose something universal and family-friendly because we want to inspire sculptors to entertain the masses, but also tap into their creative side and bring forward things that are important to them.

Dave Graham: In terms of the sculptors and the process of getting in - must they apply? How does that work?

Cheryl Dill: Yes, that is a process. We align our criteria with other sand sculpting competitions around the world and also ensure that our participants and finalists are capable of carrying on to world championships. Basically, we're looking for people with master sculptor experience, or significant experience in other competitions, and who have sculpted professionally in sand and perhaps other media - ice, snow, sandstone, or other rock. Some sculptors work professionally designing sets for movies, sculpting natural-looking rock backgrounds. We're looking for significant and recent professional experience. Many of our applicants come from the Race Against the Tide - the CBC competition - and many carry on after our event to the Revere Beach competition in Boston. A lot of them are doing that this year, actually.

Dave Graham: Do you get more applicants than you have spaces?

Cheryl Dill: Yes, that is always a challenge. Wendy Sears, our beloved event manager and marketing manager, has the fun job of narrowing it down. She has a great relationship with sculptors around the world and puts out the criteria. First, we always offer spots to those who previously won in our competitions - soloists and team events - and they always qualify, so that's eight spots out of 22. Then we recruit from new and existing sculptors. This year we have about 30 sculptors altogether, with about three new ones. The rest are old hands to this community. We're really excited about the group.

Dave Graham: Let's chat about the People's Choice Award - the angle of participation involving the public so that they are part of this whole thing.

Cheryl Dill: I love that. The sculptors covet that award because they know their sculptures have been standing for five and a half weeks and have had the observations of almost 120,000 visitors. When we announce it, they jump for joy if they're the successful winners. Sometimes the results are very similar to what the judges chose on opening weekend, and sometimes they vary. Last year we had quite a variation. We had over 110,000 votes, or close to that. We give everybody a voting chip when they come through the gate, and then they can walk around and select which sculptures they prefer - what spoke to their hearts, what spoke to their minds. They love that.

Dave Graham: As for those special evenings when these works of art are illuminated - how long has that been going on?

Cheryl Dill: I think we started that in about 2015. It was such a brilliant idea. Wendy Sears, our former event manager who still helps us with promotion and marketing, said, "Why are we not lighting these things up at night?" Because the intricacies of those sculptures - the edges and curves - you don't see them as well in the sunlight. When they're lit up at night with beautiful colours, purples, greens, pinks, you really see them in a different perspective. It makes for beautiful camera shots. It's magical. It feels like a very calm version of Disney - you don't have to wait in those lineups. It just feels magical and beautiful. And when you add a harpist like Sarah, who's been playing harp for so many years for us, it adds an extra special touch. And if it aligns with the Quality Foods light-up show and the fireworks, then that just makes for an incredible weekend.

Dave Graham: Opening weekend is always a major draw. How was last year's show, and what are the plans for this year?

Cheryl Dill: We were incredibly honoured to host Chilliwack's Farewell to Friends Tour. We were honoured that they selected us as part of their closing performances. It was well-attended and magical for people there because they understood the meaning behind it. It brought back memories of listening to Chilliwack through the '70s, '80s, and '90s. It was a successful event and our second year doing an opening concert - the first year it was Trooper, which was fantastic. And then this year, rock icons and Canadian Hall of Famers April Wine. They're coming from Nova Scotia, my home province. I remember sitting on Citadel Hill watching many a Canada Day concert with April Wine. I'm really excited to have them here. We also get to feature Tumbling Dice, a beloved Victoria band that's been in our park entertaining crowds for a few years now. It's going to be a great opening weekend. That's Saturday, July 11th. There are still tickets, so I'll tell you - you won't regret coming to BeachFest opening weekend, taking in the sand sculptures, and seeing April Wine perform.

Dave Graham: Lloyd Derry has once again associated himself with BeachFest. Could you put into words what he does for this event?

Cheryl Dill: Lloyd is one of our board directors and is incredibly passionate about music. He's one of many volunteers who works really hard on putting the whole festival together. Lloyd has been working with a team of volunteers to put together the whole concert lineup this year. One of the things he's incredibly excited about is the Blue Rodeo concert. We're working with a company out of Victoria - Collective Entertainment and Events Group - to make that happen. We've partnered with them; they signed the contract with Blue Rodeo and we're hosting it, so we're sharing all the work together. If there are proceeds from that concert - and we hope so, because it is a fundraiser - we're splitting them so we can work on another incredible band acquisition for next year. It's a big thing for our town to bring a band of this stature to Parksville. We want to make it memorable and fun, but we also have to mitigate the risk involved in having that many people in the park. We've been working with the local RCMP and our municipality to make sure it's going to be a success. One of the great things Brian, our events manager for the theater, has done in concert with Lloyd is secured a shuttle service - if you want to park by Wembley Mall or further up and not bring your car to the park, there will be shuttles going back and forth from one end of the community to the other. People can buy tickets for the shuttle through the MAC box office.

Dave Graham: I guess it goes without saying that these kinds of things can't happen without a lot of free help. Volunteers make all the difference. What do you have to say about them?

Cheryl Dill: Our society is all based on volunteerism. We do pay contractors for some expertise - our event managers, for instance. We have three event managers who work between the theater and the sand sculpting exhibition, plus one who helps with marketing. But everything else, for the most part, is volunteerism. Our board is entirely volunteer. Our gate ambassadors who greet those 120,000 people through the gates - there are 150 volunteers there. We also have about 45 to 50 volunteers for the theater. Everybody is really passionate about what they do. They understand that giving back to the community gives them purpose. They've got talents and abilities to share - whether that's physically helping set up a fence, preparing the sand sculpting site, putting up scrim around the fence, installing lights in the exhibition, or keeping the washrooms clean so that everybody can enjoy the park. Some of that may not sound like fun, but when you're working with other volunteers for a great cause, there's great camaraderie and great pride in a successful event. It just connects you with other people who feel the same way, and you feel good by doing something worthwhile. About 90% of our volunteers return every year. So it's a lot of fun.

Dave Graham: And if it isn't too late, would people just check out the website for how to follow up about volunteering?

Cheryl Dill: Absolutely. If you haven't already volunteered and want to figure out how, there's our email - info@beachfest.ca - and our phone number on the site. Christie, our wonderful event manager for the sand sculpting site, has that phone every day and is checking it. By all means, just get in touch with us and we'll put you to good work.

Dave Graham: Another important component of an event like this is the relationship with the business community. Quality Foods, Canadian Tire, Tim Horton's, Coastal Community Credit Union, Mid-Island Co-op. What do you have to say about these partners?

Cheryl Dill: Again, you're giving me goosebumps. It's not without work to get sponsorship coming forward, but this community has been incredibly generous. I can't say enough about Quality Foods. They've been by our side for so many years. They were the instigators in 1982 about getting Beach Festival underway, and in our new format they didn't walk away - they were always there. And then all those other sponsors: Coastal Community Credit Union, Canadian Tire, VanRock Enterprises, which has come on board for our opening concert two years in a row now, Mid-Island Co-op. We've got over 100 sponsors, so I apologize if I didn't mention you. We're so incredibly grateful. We have them on our website. We sculpt them in the berm, and we do what we can to acknowledge them, because without their support, we just can't do what we do.

Dave Graham: Any last words or thoughts to add to this?

Cheryl Dill: I'm just grateful to have this conversation, because when you're busy working on an event, sometimes you don't take your head out of the game and say, "Hey, what actually are we doing here?" It's a good reminder to just be grateful for the opportunity to work together with other like-minded people, to share a common experience that brings joy to so many. Thank you for the opportunity to speak about it. I think what Peter McCully and you, Dave Graham, do with your podcast is a wonderful thing.

Peter McCully: Thanks to Cheryl Dill for joining us. This year's theme, Beauties and Beasts, promises some extraordinary works from the international group of master sculptors, and the opening weekend concert featuring April Wine on July 11th is going to be one of the summer's highlights. The grand opening is July 10th with a ribbon-cutting at 2:00 PM. Get your tickets now. Details at parksvillebeachfest.ca.

Dave Graham: April Wine live in Parksville. Canadian Music Industry Hall of Famers. 16 albums. Canadian rock royalty. Saturday evening, July 11th, they are going to rock the park. See what I did there?

Peter McCully: April Wine fans are with you on that one, Dave. And we have new stories for the kids coming out each week with our Skookum Kids Stories featuring Captain Dave and the crew of the Mellow Submarine and Peter and Gracie the Eskimo Dog. Our kids stories now come with colouring pages to go along with each new episode.

Dave Graham: On this week's episode of Peter and Gracie, Gracie loses her squeaky toy, Hector the Hedgehog. I don't want to give too much away here, but I'll say this: if you have ever lost something important to you and couldn't figure out where it went, this story will resonate deeply.

Peter McCully: We invite you to dig into our Radio Archaeology classic radio series with original episodes of Dragnet, featuring Sergeant Joe Friday, and Gunsmoke with Marshal Matt Dillon.

Dave Graham: And we hope you will take in another offering from a member of The PULSE Community. Cindy Thompson of Parksville hosts A Resilience Project. This week, Caleb Dahlgren survived the Humboldt Broncos tragedy. He beat the odds with Type 1 diabetes and wrote a number one bestselling memoir. His story of resilience is unforgettable.

Peter McCully: This country was moved as one by the Humboldt Broncos story, and Caleb Dahlgren's story is one of perseverance and purpose. That's a conversation worth making time for.

Dave Graham: You'll find these podcasts and more at thepulsecommunity.ca. And while you're there, sign up for our newsletter and keep up to date on the latest podcasts, guests, and contests.

Thrifty Foods Parksville: At Thrifty Foods, we love to help nonprofits, charities, and schools. Our Thrifty Foods Smile Card bulk program allows organizations to immediately save up to 6% on the purchase of Smile Cards in bulk, allowing you to keep more money in your organization's pockets. Ask for details at Thrifty Foods in Parksville.

Ian Lindsay & Associates: Ian Lindsay of Lindsay and Associates has played an active role in the local community since 1979. He has been with RE/MAX, Vancouver Island's most advanced real estate business network, since 1996, marketing and selling residential, rural, strata, recreational, investment, and project development real estate. You'll find true real estate professionals at ianlindsay.ca.

Peter McCully: Dave, I can't help but notice that your summertime to-do list is getting a few revisions.

Dave Graham: I'm rewriting the whole thing, Peter. I'm scratching off learning to walk a slack line - there just isn't time. I'm going to have to postpone the windsurfing lessons and the bonsai tree project. That just isn't going to happen this summer. But I've got to be flexible, change with the times. I need to get caught up on the latest season of a podcast created practically just down the road from us.

Peter McCully: Yes, that's a worthy pursuit, Dave, and our next guest has spent years sitting with stories that don't have easy endings, and she tells them with the kind of care and rigour they deserve. Here's Marilyn.

Marilyn: Laura Palmer of Port Alberni is the host of the award-winning podcast Island Crime, a true crime podcast for listeners who love in-depth, victim-focused storytelling. Laura has just launched her ninth season of the highly rated true crime series.

Peter McCully: Thanks for joining us on the podcast today, Laura.

Laura Palmer: Thank you for having me on again. I really appreciate it.

Peter McCully: I'm eager for our listeners to learn what Season 9 of Island Crime is all about. The new season has just been released. It's entitled "The Dead File." Perhaps you can give us an overview of the series.

Laura Palmer: The series is about the unsolved murders of Elizabeth and Andrew Kosonic. They were stabbed to death in their own home just south of Nanaimo in a community called South Wellington in June of 1959. I had never heard anything about the case - I knew absolutely nothing about it - until last year when I was approached by their great-great-granddaughter, who on her own has been researching the case and trying to understand this horrible tragedy in her family. She's a listener of my podcast and thought it might be something that I could work on together with her. So that's what we've been doing for the last six or seven months, and the first episode is out now.

Peter McCully: The season title comes from a stamp on the actual police folder - "dead file, no further work to be done." When you saw that stamped on a double murder case, what went through your mind?

Laura Palmer: What we're generally told with unsolved cases by the police is that there's no such thing as a dead file - that the cases will always stay open, that they may be dormant for a while, but they're never closed. So that was the first time I had ever heard of the idea of a dead file. In the series, I interview a retired RCMP detective from Nanaimo who helps me understand this release package, and he said he'd never heard of the idea of a dead file either. So either it's quite unusual, or it's the kind of thing that was more common seven decades ago. But in any event, it's the first time I came across a file called a dead file.

Peter McCully: The episode starts out with you and your husband chatting about the news of the death of Rob Reiner and his wife, and your husband's comments regarding stabbing deaths in particular. Your husband has some insight into crime itself.

Laura Palmer: Yes. My husband is a judge here in Port Alberni. He's had many violent cases in his courtroom, and he was a defense attorney and a crown attorney before that. So a fair amount of experience in the criminal world. His first reaction to Rob Reiner's death and the death of his wife was, "Yeah, a stabbing in their own home? That's probably a family member." And that's within seconds of it coming across the wires. I was thinking about that when I was beginning my work on the Kosonic case, because they too were stabbed to death in their own home, a couple. Although initially, and in the reporting on the story that I've read, the police are framing it as a robbery gone wrong. The family has always believed that it was more likely their son-in-law was the guilty party.

Peter McCully: Tell us about Shauna - Andrew and Elizabeth's great-great-granddaughter. What made you say yes when she came to you with this file?

Laura Palmer: Well, first of all, she was almost reluctant to bring the file to me. She said, "You know, I've been doing this work, and it's important to me and my family, but I get it if you don't want to take this on. It's almost seven decades old. There's never going to be a court case. No one is ever going to be brought to legal justice, and maybe you have more important, more pressing work to do." All of these kinds of things were going through her head, and we talked about that. But the more I learned about the case, the more I thought - it doesn't matter that it was seven decades ago. These were two victims, two community members who met a violent end, and whose murders have never been solved. I talk about the old Harry Bosch saying in the series: "Everybody counts or nobody counts." That certainly seemed true to me in Andrew and Elizabeth's case. And I should say, I call them Andrew and Elizabeth at the outset, but everybody in the community knew them as Lizzie and Curly. Later on in the series, that's also what I come to call them, because as you get to know these people, they just become more familiar to you. I think listeners, even though it's a 67-year-old case, will really relate to and connect with Lizzie and Curly as they go through the series.

Peter McCully: As you say, you're going back 67 years for this case. Wouldn't that make finding any new details even more difficult?

Laura Palmer: Yes and no. On the no side - we were able to access some archival material, including a coroner's report, autopsies, and psychiatric records. This is the kind of material that in an open and unsolved recent case you wouldn't get to see right now. So that part was easier. The part that's harder, of course, is that I normally begin my work by talking to family and friends. In this case, there are very few people alive who knew Lizzie and Curly in life - though after the trailer dropped, I heard from even more. There are still people alive here on the island, and elsewhere, who knew Lizzie and Curly, who remember the murder. And then of course the story has been passed down through generations. There are people who say, "I remember my grandmother talking about this. They were neighbours." Although that part was a little harder, it is interesting to hear how the story has rippled down through the years. Certainly in Shauna's family, their descendants all have a story to tell about how it has impacted them.

Peter McCully: It sounds like those archival records and psychiatric files - being something you might not normally have access to - would be very valuable.

Laura Palmer: Absolutely. What happened back then was there was a coroner's inquest that happened quite soon after the murders, where they interviewed the people who found the bodies, the first police on the scene, and the last people to see them alive. It's kind of like a little play in a way, because you have all of these characters saying exactly what they saw and observed. And then the autopsies themselves - I'd never seen this kind of detail in an autopsy before. I had a retired coroner help me look at it through a medical examiner's lens, which was really helpful because there were so many medical terms in there. The one thing I'll add to the challenges: the police have yet to release the full file to us. We have a heavily redacted file which largely consists of administrative notes. Even though this file is 67 years old, the RCMP are still reluctant to release the details of the investigation. So Shauna and I have both lodged complaints to the Information and Privacy Commissioner, and we're still hoping that more will be released.

Peter McCully: Now, you've mentioned in past interviews that in all of the stories you tell, you return to visit the scene of the crime. This being 67 years after the fact, where were you able to return to, and what were those impressions?

Laura Palmer: As it turns out - and I think listeners will find this quite fascinating - the house, which is described as "the murder house" in the newspapers back then, is still standing. I went there right at the very beginning and knocked at the door, and the owners were lovely and invited me in. They were also open to Shauna coming to the place where her great-great-grandparents were murdered. So that house figures quite prominently in the series, because even though there have been some changes and additions, a lot of the original structure is still standing. When you look at the coroner's report and imagine where things happened, we were able to walk around the house and try to go back in time and picture how it all would have unfolded in 1959.

Peter McCully: We'll certainly be glued to our chairs as this series unravels. It sounds very, very interesting.

Laura Palmer: I think it's a super interesting story. And as Shauna has said, you learn a lot about a family's history, some dark chapters, and a lot about the investigation. It ended up being an eight-part series. As I think you know, Pete, if I learn more, it will become longer. I always keep working on things. After the trailer dropped, new leads on a 67-year-old murder file. I'm hopeful that will continue to happen as the series carries on.

Peter McCully: My next question was going to be about updates. Tell us about Jeff Ingram. He's one of your update interviews, and he's discussing his experiences with dissociative amnesia, tied to the Ian Indridson vanishing in January 2022.

Laura Palmer: You're right. In between seasons, I go back and try to update earlier series, because podcasts are a funny thing in that they never really have to end. If you get more information or think of a new perspective, you can update things. When I was researching Ian Indridson's case - Ian disappeared from his Victoria home in January, kinda out of the blue, this senior government official just gone one morning - his wife raised the possibility of a fugue state. I didn't really know much about that, so I started researching. I found a fellow from down in Washington State who has had dissociative fugue experiences - I think he said five times over his life, one which lasted about two years and another nine months or so. The most famous one involving Jeff: he was headed up to Alberta to visit a dying friend in his truck. The next thing he knows, it's nine months later and he's in Colorado. He walks into a hospital and says, "Help me, I don't know who I am or where I've been." A TV appeal goes out, and that's how his fiancee at the time finds out what happened to him. Ian Indridson's wife still wonders to this day if that could be the kind of thing that happened to her husband. It's really unusual - rare, for sure - but in the absence of answers, it's just one of the things she wonders about.

Peter McCully: I was reminded of Season 1, Where Is Lisa?, which digs into the disappearance of 21-year-old Lisa Marie Young, when I saw a billboard on the back of a bus last week.

Laura Palmer: Yes. The family and friends of Lisa Marie Young are so determined and so creative that they really try and think of everything they can to keep her name and face out there in the community. They were approached by an organization called The Little Red Dress Project, which works with families of missing and murdered Indigenous women to keep their stories and cases alive. They're the ones who funded that campaign. This is one of those cases where the answers are in the community. There is still a suspect alive, and I hope one day will be brought to justice. But this kind of thing - the bus campaign - keeps it out there, keeps the pressure on, and hopefully one day there will be justice for her family.

Peter McCully: As you mentioned with the family of Lisa Marie Young, the stories that you cover on Island Crime involve families who need resources and support in their fight. How can listeners help?

Laura Palmer: Every case is a bit different in that way. In Lisa Marie Young's case, the family really appreciates it when people turn up at the annual March for Justice, which happens on the Canada Day weekend every year. Throughout the year, they quite often have other smaller events. They also appreciate people joining the advocacy Facebook page, and that's something a lot of families do - Ian Indridson's wife has a Facebook page for him. That's something I think families appreciate across the board, if they're of a mind that they want the community to be involved. Some families have an annual walk, sometimes around the date of the murder or disappearance. They're all so different. I would say for the most part, it's just remembering and caring about their families. People appreciate that.

Peter McCully: Now nine seasons in, your audience has grown. You're an award-winning podcast, and those listeners expect things from you. They follow the cases, they have opinions, and they send you tips.

Laura Palmer: They do. I had a note the other day referring to me and my team, and I chuckled a little because the team is myself, my cat, and my dog. The team is only me. While I really love my listeners - they are amazing and so loyal and supportive - I do at times feel it's important for people to understand that I work alone and I like it that way, but that does mean sometimes it can be a while between seasons or updates or new episodes. It's not the kind of podcast where there is going to be something out every week. The nature of the work is that it takes time, and I think mostly people get that.

Peter McCully: Now, you've spoken very openly about bad faith actors in the true crime podcast space. What separates responsible true crime journalism from exploitation, and how do you hold yourself to that line?

Laura Palmer: I try not to be sitting up on my pedestal judging other people, because people feel differently about these things. Some people enjoy listening to podcasts where it's more conversational and people are having a glass of wine and chatting about the details, and I think that's fine. For me, these are serious stories with huge impacts on people's lives, and the tone I take reflects that. The one thing I would say - I hate it when true crime stories glamorize or make these monsters into celebrities. I listened recently to a series about Clifford Olson, and it made my skin crawl. They were playing tape of Olson's voice throughout the series. He loved the limelight - that was his whole thing - so giving him that kind of airtime feels just wrong to me. But again, I hate criticizing other people's work. I stopped listening after just a little bit into that series, so maybe there are redemptive qualities to it. I don't know.

Peter McCully: Laura, I know that you and your sisters have writing and documentary backgrounds. I can't help wondering if there are books or documentary series down the road.

Laura Palmer: I occasionally think about that, but for now, honestly, I personally have my hands full with doing an audio podcast. There aren't really enough hours in the day to cover these stories in as much depth as I want. Who knows what the future holds, but right now the audio podcast is absolutely my main focus.

Dave Graham: Laura Palmer and Island Crime, Season 9. If you have not listened to Island Crime, now's the perfect time to start. And if you're a longtime listener, you already know how good this is. You'll find links to the podcast in our story notes at thepulsecommunity.ca.

Peter McCully: If you have someone in mind you think we should be talking to, please reach out. You can leave a voice or text message - head to our website and click on the contact link. You'll find us at thepulsecommunity.ca. You can also find us on Apple, Amazon, iHeart, Spotify, TikTok, and YouTube. We're also on Facebook and Instagram.

Dave Graham: I was planning to grow my own wheat and mill it for sourdough bread. I think I'm going to have to scratch that one.

Peter McCully: How is that list coming along, Dave?

Dave Graham: You know what? I just realized there's so much going on, I'm going to have to reverse direction completely and concentrate on simplifying one thing at a time. I'm going to throw away the list. Who needs a list anyway? I'm going to focus on my next big thing. That's BeachFest. Oh, did I mention that I was DJ for that? Yeah, I probably have.

Rockin' Rhonda & The Uptown Blues Band: Here comes Peter, here comes Dave, oh listen. Bringing stories, making waves, no missing. Spinning tales in the podcast cave, so to speak. Laughs and insights everywhere - what a treat. Peter and Dave, they're on the mics. All right, join the ride. It's gonna feel just right.